General Discussion

General Discussionnew meta

new meta in General Discussion
._.

    spec + dominator is a thing now?

    Androgynous

      spectre usually needs some early game items to help her not be useless. either items that help her farm for big items, or items that help her fight early.

      dominator is good because it gives useful stats (6 hp, armour and hp regen) and also the dominated creep can be used for farming. the creep got buffed this patch (more damage, health and mana regen) so you can use it to push out waves that your hero would be unsafe to farm, or use it to tank neutrals.

      2640

        it got nerfed -15 dmg

        kowareta

          isnt blade mail or yasha same cost?
          just buy 2 bracers....

          Androgynous

            yasha is worse than dominator. you have no health regen or a creep to tank for you so if a fight happens u can't do anything, and less tankiness overall. a creep hitting for 100 is probably better than the attack speed too.

            blade mail is better in fights for sure, and the passive damage return does help farm a bit but nowhere near as good as dominator.

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              Spec + Meteor try that

              Shou

                dominator is good

                kowareta

                  i mean it costs 2350 gold!!!! and specially the recipe cost is crazy high!!!
                  im not sure about this but i think domi creep damage type is not like necros. it wont boost your farming like necros.

                  like u must be crazy to think its broken. dominator active is the biggest insult happened to the item :)). 975 gold for literally nothing.
                  ench W on lvl 2 do exactly the same for free. and u wont feed +200 gold to enemies. and its just lvl 2, on lvl 4 u have almost 3 times better creep than domi creep in terms of damage!!!

                  if u want regen and armor, ok just buy helm and later u can build nulli. but domi is garbage to me.

                  and i didnt compared it with just yasha or just blademail. i said 2 bracers is better in terms of cost, stats, regen and damage and after it u can go for your blademail or yasha.

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                  optimum pride( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

                    I've tried dominator on spec only once this patch, pretty good i got lucky with jelly but still need constant clarity shipment, got my radi then buy blademail, and the enemy can't even kill me anymore.

                    Can't wait to try meme hammer next

                    Androgynous

                      necro damage got changed from piercing (150% vs creeps) to hero (100% vs creeps), so necro got worse for farming creeps.

                      not all neutrals have the same attack damage type. big creeps are usually hero (e.g. centaur, net troll, etc). medium creeps basic (worst type), while smaller ones usually have piercing, which is the ghost lady is one of the best for farming - base damage almost equal to big creeps (47 vs 52), but lower base attack time (1.0 vs average ~1.4) and piercing damage type.

                      yeah ench can control creeps and boost their damage but ench cant give you the gold from the last hits that creep gets so that isn't really relevant. that just tells me that dominator is redundant on enchantress.

                      idk if it's "broken" i've not played spec since the new patch but i understand why people get dominator, and it's definitely good when you look at the other alternatives for farming. it's just a farming item that doesn't make u 100% useless like a midas or something.

                      2 bracers + yasha is more expensive than dominator, uses more slots, doesn't help u farm as quickly, is less regen and armour, and doesn't give you a unit to tank neutrals with, so you won't be full hp if you haunt in. 2x bracer has 4 more str which only matters if ur dying to 100% non-physical damage, because dom gives 4.5 more armour.

                      u can go blade mail / yasha after dom too. but you probably wouldn't go dominator with bracers, hence the comparison. for simplicity say the stats from bracer and dom are equal, so that means you're paying 1300g for a creep that massively helps u farm or push out waves.

                      kowareta

                        ench cant give you the gold from the last hits that creep gets so that isn't really relevant

                        what do u even mean? O.o

                        Shou

                          iltw going drums blademail p much eveyr game on spec

                          Androgynous

                            "what do u even mean? O.o"

                            you're saying
                            "ench W on lvl 2 do exactly the same for free"

                            ench's controlled creep killing other creeps does not give gold to spectre so why is ench relevant in this discussion.

                            kowareta

                              yeah, i dont really get the regen/tanking creep logic. like i bet if u buy only 5 tango in start of the game, u still have them after 40 minutes. spec needs mana regen more than health regen for farming

                              Androgynous

                                so that you're full hp when a fight starts.

                                yes you still have to buy mana regen but your other build also does on top of health regen.

                                kowareta

                                  im comparing ench W to domi active. if domi active is super good for farming, ench W is 3 times better. and we all know ench sucks ass.

                                  kowareta

                                    so that you're full hp when a fight starts.

                                    u can always tp base and haunt for fights, thats the common play among high mmr players.

                                    Shou

                                      well ench can jungle fast with dominated creep but ench doesnt care abt farming she cares abt taking dookies on lane against noob, but spectre wanna hit jungle creep and get fat.

                                      using a tp and a haunt means ur stuck with ur team after u finish a fight with haunt, but usually u want the freedom to haunt to a fight and then tp away to farm. that being said, buying drums helps a lot with mana regen which otherwise u will have to ferry if u buy helm, so after the nerf its probably better to go drums.

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                                      kowareta

                                        is she ? my point was even ench cant farm fast with that :D

                                        nah, pretty sure gold = win. thats nature law

                                        Beast of no Nation

                                          I think since the creeps dmg got nerfed it is better to get a Blademail and Rush the Radi after. BM is Just of way more use If you would have to Join Fights early.
                                          And If your lane went Well was and youre Off to a good start you can Rush the Radi First an anyway.
                                          Also using the dominated creep to have an actual Impact in Fights is Something that doesnt really Happen in Low Level pubs.

                                          optimum pride( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

                                            Well i pretty sure used the harpy to slow them everytime i go on them, it's not really hard killing someone with the help of neut creep tbh

                                            Androgynous

                                              @kowareta
                                              ok i misunderstood your point too, now i see. though ench dominates big creeps (hero type) and hits heroes. if you took a ghost (piercing type) and hit creeps with it you'll see it clears waves decently. obv ench needs to do more than hit creeps to win games but that's going off topic.

                                              im not saying dominator is the best farming item but of the items / item builds that help you do something in fights (cos it gives some stats), this is probably the best at farming. whereas just going naked radiance and hoping ur not punished for being ultra greedy is more risky. i think the extra 1300g you pay compared to 2x wraith or 2x bracers often pays for itself.

                                              not just killing creeps quicker but the most important I think is pushing out waves unsafe for your hero to be in, pushing out the other side of the map when you haunt into a fight, or delaying pushes by dragging creeps, all of these help slow the game which is often what spectre wants.

                                              "BM is Just of way more use If you would have to Join Fights early.
                                              And If your lane went Well was and youre Off to a good start you can Rush the Radi First an anyway."

                                              so what if your lane doesn't go well and you're not in a position to take fights either?
                                              i think there are games where you don't have a free lane but you still want to avoid fights and just farm for radiance. in that case having helm + crown in lane helps your lane go smoother, stall out the game, and in games where you are contested, going early game items into radiance is probably just as fast as going naked radiance.

                                              Shou

                                                i mean hotd isnt strictly the best farming item for spec, but it helps her farm faster, take less damage doing so, and be tanky, the tankiness stats for her were good, but with the helm nerfs it seems pros are shifting towards drum and blademail more now.

                                                ETd

                                                  It's either dominator, blade mail, or necrobook 1

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                                                    Necrobook sucks in this patch for farming.
                                                    Blade mail is becoming a must build on spec even late game. 42%(47%) passive dmg return-too good swap out.
                                                    Dominator is good but doesn't sort your mana issue.
                                                    Meteor hammer is a good too. It gives good regen, buildup now needs a ring which can be picked as first item(which is good for lane sustain and saves gold on early regen), gives you ability to clear lane creeps without showing yourself on map and with more mana efficiency than using dagger.

                                                    Oldman

                                                      I think I would go yasha or bm as well instead of domi, just because you wont have slot for it, and yasha builds up into manta.

                                                      Necro was good but now its not so...

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