General Discussion

General DiscussionEvasion Stacking on TA

Evasion Stacking on TA in General Discussion
Jules

    I was messing around in a custom while waiting for a friend and tried the following build
    3 butterflies
    1 daedalus
    1 blink dagger
    And of course, boots
    This build felt amazingly strong as the damage, attack speed and evasion was huuugee, you're pretty much invisible and dealing insane amounts of damage (I know the enemy team could just buy mkb but still)

    My question is, is there a limit to how much evasion can be stacked, because 3 butterflies=105% wouldn't that mean you can't take any physical damage at all whats so ever?
    I walked into the enemy fountain and if i use my Q i can stand there for about 15 seconds almost unharmed but I still do take some shots now and then.

    I feel this wacky, expensive build is extremely strong, even if the enemy were to get mkb, was just looking for more info on evasion and how it is stacked

    Tempest Bloom

      It stacks diminishingly, not additively

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      Zenoth

        It stacks diminishingly, but the EHP it gives is multiplicative. A TB illusion with 3 butterflies takes 10k physical damage to take down and can tank a fountain's barrage for about 10 seconds.

        Fay

          so just around 73% dodge from 3 butterfly, am i correct?

          epsik-kun

            Yep.

            Androgynous

              1st bfly - 35% chance to dodge, therefore a 65% chance to get hit

              2nd bfly - 35% chance to dodge the 65% of attacks that don't miss, so the 65% of attacks that hit you when you only had 1 butterfly, only 65% of that 65% hit.
              i.e P(attack does not miss) = 0.65 x 0.65 = 0.4425 (44.25%)

              3rd bfly - 35% chance to dodge the 44.25% of attacks that don't miss, so 0.65 x 0.4425 = 0.274625 = 27.46% chance to hit, or 73.54% chance to miss. The inverse of this is how much more EHP it gives you, which is 3.64 or 364%.

              To calculate the chance of a physical attack not missing, it's simply (1-evasion value) of each ability that gives evasion, multiplied by each other, where the evasion value is a decimal, not a percentage, so just divide the % value by 100. 25% = 0.25, 47% = 0.47 etc.

              so if you're PA with rank 3 blur giving 40%, a have a butterfly (35%) and a halberd (25%)
              blur = (1 - 0.4) = 0.6
              bfly = (1 - 0.35) = 0.65
              halberd (or talisman) = (1 - 0.75) = 0.75
              then multiply them all together to find out the hit chance
              0.6 x 0.65 x 0.75 = 0.2925 i.e. a 29.25% chance to hit, so a 71.75% chance to miss.

              Z__

                Crappy build unless you're playing against monkeys or if you're so far ahead that they will never have the farm for a mkb.
                http://dotabuff.com/matches/630020758
                http://dotabuff.com/matches/629942105

                Sir

                  its changed.. its alot more than 73 you get about 90% something last time i tried it its truly amazing just go try in lobby you will be mindblowned!

                  Fay

                    confirmed by masterV himself, very useful build
                    http://dotabuff.com/matches/629233179

                    Yoichi Isagi | Blue Lock

                      so butterfly stacks now pretty amazing. NO more instance of 35% etc... that's pretty dang nice also that halbred, blur, bfly build looks pretty amazing too.

                      Kryptnyt

                        MKB good item.

                        Jules

                          So it does work aye?
                          I mean I would say it works pretty much almost as good on TA as it does on PA seeing as her Q+evasion is just crazy strong, can't wait to give this build a proper go

                          Winter Wyvern

                            Really, don't do this in matches, this is the kind of stuff that eventually throws matches and has people requesting you be reported due to your throwing (because it honestly is a throw, and there are far better items to build), since they will get MKBs (if they aren't incompetent monkeys) and will proceed to pound your ass. As has been stated, it's a pretty crappy build. It's funny up until the point the MKB is made, then it's all downhill, when any other items could have been purchased to end the game sooner. It's not effective, it truly isn't- it's like 5 people who make Dagon, then the other team gets BKBs.

                            Evasion stacks diminishingly, as has been stated. MKB is a great item to begin with, people will always buy one against PA, and if you even get one butterfly on any hero, the core heroes dependent on right clicks will make MKBs as so not to miss their attacks. So don't do it, for the sake of not wasting 4 other people's time on your team by throwing a game that takes up to an hour or more to play. -_-

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