General DiscussionCan skill beat counter picking?

i was tinker vs doom and clock, plus everyone on the other team had stuns which was really fucking annoying

match: http://dotabuff.com/matches/735653402

although clock didn't really gank me and doom didn't always doom me, so it was more incompetency on the enemy part than my skill. nethertheless you can beat counterpickers

yeah
if can't then then the people who only play 1-2 heroes will have problem

Dota2 is the game of counter pick.

http://dotabuff.com/matches/734335317

doom sitting on dick and getting solo rp'd into finger an dshit

If the opponents were at least of a decent skill level of decision making and hero competency I feel it's probably hard even if you're skilled yourself.

But if you're lucky enough to get opponents who're normal / below average players you'll get a chance (eg. people who have naga disruptor invoker on their team but doesn't take a single teamfight with sleep into static storm + kinetic field + meteor/emp, or people who are only concerned about taking kills but don't push any towers after getting kills).

http://dotabuff.com/players/118305301/matches
+-6.2k MMR

http://dotabuff.com/players/86717663
+-5k

http://dotabuff.com/players/85732420
often play with dendi and friends and appear in first page of watch list

a lot more, i'm just lazy to mention

There is a saying that goes "You cant counter strat brilliance"

Or in the case of dota "You cant counter pick brilliance"

Yes it can. I won't go through all my matches too search a game in order to prove you(some ppl have already done that). If the person behind the hero is really skilled not even a counter pick would work.

In the end counters give you an advantage but that doesn't mean the game is isntawon just because your lineup counter the enemy one.

i have a problem with bloodseeker everytime i LC :< i cant jungle properly

Don't jungle, recently I have taken a liking to LC and I have been playing her as a safe lane farmer. Usually by 6-8 minutes you can have blink and boots and you can roam around killing people all day long. It works 12/15 times

only if the skill difference is huge

Do you have any idea how many times I have won with slark against a Bloodseeker and facelessvoid?

http://dotabuff.com/matches/728865823

"Do you have any idea how many times I have won with slark against a Bloodseeker and facelessvoid?"

No one knows, and since u played dota 35 years before dota was created - you prolly dont exist

zenoth are u in top 50 ta or smth, your wr with ta is ridiculously good

hungry ghost yuyuko :3
theres no such thing a hero can completely shuts down another cuz items are still there for people to choose

you can beat sniper with es if youre good enough so yes.

Counterpicking is medium, big problem is counter playing, because you can't do anything about it.
Source: I played OD very often, and whenever my enemies put huge pressure on winning their mid (for example by having a lich dual laning with their Viper), I can't make the impact that I should be doing.
There are things such as countering Nyx with OD, or countering Ursa with Phoenix that work if you just play the matchup often enough.
But that's not nearly close to become some kind of auto win. If the enemies want to shut you down, then you rely on your team mates to save you.

The problem is that a counterpick is a so much safer way to win a game than playing a hero incredibly good. For example, if you pick Pugna, it can be your first game with the hero and you might be able to destroy the enemy OD/Skywrath no matter how many million games he has played. Matchups like these are simply impossible and no matter how good you are, you are gonna get wrecked.

I play meepo a lot, and I still get nervous on picking him, just for the Earthshaker/AoE hero bits.

But then I just go pipe and all is forgotten.

It's more about your team as a whole though than a single hero. Slark can still win vs bloodseeker if the rest of his team can handle bs.

There is strategy and mechanical skill

counter picking = strategy
why?

everyone has a choice
captains mode or all pick
even in all pick, u can counter pick or choose an overall strong hero
after which if the opponent counter picks, your teammates can counter/make up for it

in the end,
people who complain the most about counter picks are
the INSTANPICKS / tiny hero pool players

people underestimate the drafting phase in AP and thats when shit happens
kinda like when theres PA, Sniper, spectre and AM in my team. What godlike hero can support the 4 of them?

Definitely skill can beat counter picking. It's just more stressful and time-consuming, that's all.

Source:
1)I've lost from an epic dazzle with phaseboots, medallion, armlet and desolator who was safelane stealing farm and kills from his carry, mega troll. Kappa :D
2)I've lost mid as an sf from a crystal maiden who managed to farm with her first spell a dagger on minute 9 even after all the creeps that i denied from her.
3)I've lost in dota 1 more than once from a master techies player and i even had maphack turned on some times and evaded his bombs until he unconsciously forced all of my team, including me, on them during several fights. What a player, i will never forget him... And for that, he will always have my utmost respect...